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The Rings of Power - Discussion
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@Arkandel said in The Rings of Power - Discussion:
As for the race card, IMHO especially in this specific show it’s almost pure racism. Yes, I am 100% sure the very, very Anglo-Saxon and product of his age author envisioned most characters in his head to be white. But when Ilúvatar or Aulë the Smith created People they might have thrown in some melanin variations, why not?
I didn’t find this to be distracting at all - whereas in the Wheel of Time it came off as really weird sometimes that small isolated villages looked like Manhattan, race-wise.To this point, I was actually gleeful imagining all the outrage the casting was causing. Like, more talented people are getting work they deserve and it’s kinda-sorta becoming the golden age of television, babyyyyy. Fuck the whiny toxic dipshits who can’t handle their precious imaginary racist “utopia” getting thrown in the trash where it belongs.
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@Wizz I would have been outraged if they made Galadriel anything but a blonde since so much was written specifically about her hair. Tolkien had a thing!
Also, my understanding is they will compress the events of the Second Age within a few decades (years?) to avoid basically all of the mortals in the cast dying off after the first couple of episodes. I guess yeah, that deviates from the books but I’d chalk it up as a necessary part of adopting the work to a different storytelling medium.
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People who are mad about dark-skinned Harfoots clearly didn’t actually read the books they claim to be sticklers for. Ironic outrage is ironic.
So far, I adore the way Hobbits and Dwarves have been portrayed, and holy shit Khazad-dûm is goddamn majestic and beautiful.
I dislike the adaptation of the Elves, and wish they were a little more ethereal and otherworldly. They encapsulate the main problem I have with the show altogether, which is the HBOificiation of Tolkien’s work; adapting an adult fairytale into a modern edgy fantasy for modern edgy teens. LotR is vastly superior to GoT in my eyes, and has no need to imitate the latter’s success. The parts of the show I’ve liked best are the ones that really lean into the magic of Middle-Earth instead of hamming up the grit. So like, less of Galadriel chopping up trolls with a giant sword, more of the weird guy whispering to fireflies please.
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@Kestrel This is my all-time favorite quote about the way Tolkien envisioned his Elves, as spoken by Treebeard:
“Elves began it, of course, waking trees up and teaching them to speak and learn their tree-talk. They always wished to talk to everything, the old Elves did. But then the Great Darkness came, and they passed away over the Sea, or fled into far valleys and hid themselves, and made songs about days that would never come again. Never again.”
Mind you, I am enjoying the show, but I wish they wouldn’t make Elves… optimistic. They have lost, and can see their own end, even in the Second Age; they are nostalgic about what came before, not optimistic about what’s yet to come.
This is perfectly captured in the nature of the Three, which are neither weapons nor tools, only ways to preserve and maintain. As a race they aren’t even trying to expand; just to keep what they have, and not decline further. They love Middle Earth but it’s their nature to retreat, reflect and ultimately diminish.
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@Arkandel “This authority who’s dead and therefore can’t speak for himself totally agrees with my opinions, which I shall now prove he would do by citing nothing he ever said which would support my assertion.”
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@GF said in The Rings of Power - Discussion:
@Arkandel “This authority who’s dead and therefore can’t speak for himself totally agrees with my opinions, which I shall now prove he would do by citing nothing he ever said which would support my assertion.”
I tend to assume anyone who does this to complain about “wokeness” is basically just the kid in Jojo Rabbit – running around with his imaginary friend in his head, telling us all what he’d want, with all perception of said imaginary friend completely divorced from reality, and to be taken about as seriously as, yes, Taika Watiti playing Hitler.
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@GF Well, J.R.R. Tolkien’s opinions on race were… pretty clear, I think. We don’t need to resort to necromancy or anything.
“I have the hatred of apartheid in my bones; and most of all I detest the segregation or separation of Language and Literature. I do not care which of them you think White." - JRR Tolkien, in his own words, denouncing any conscription of his stories to a specific race. -
@Arkandel In case my post came off as addressing you rather than Elon, I’d just like to clarify that now.
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ADMIN EDIT by Tez:
Removed racist content.
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@Sam-Hyde Hi! We don’t do racism here. So cut it out.
He/Him. Opinions and views are solely my own unless specifically stated otherwise.
BE AN ADULT -
@Pavel Oh yeah? Well, Elves suck. Fucking know-it-alls.
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On the other hand the depiction of Dwarves in this series is fucking amazing and possibly the best part of it for me. I didn’t see that coming! Disa and Durin are awesome.
Online posts trying to guess who Sauron is are so funny, too.
<literally any new character appears>
<DiCaprio meme pointing at screen> -
Durin + Elrond are amazing!
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@Arkandel said in The Rings of Power - Discussion:
Durin + Elrond are amazing!
Disa always wanted a new table.
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I’ll probably have more coherent thoughts later but I dipped by toe in over the weekend and I am hooked, in spite of myself. Seems really well-done all around.
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I gotta admit, some of the shine came off for me in the episode before last when Galadriel confronted Halbrand and was basically like, “ugh pathetic, man you’re above these commoner rags.”
I know it’s probably an incredibly silly thing to complain about considering this is Tolkien but like, the whole romantic fantasy of how noble and divine the concept of monarchy is just strikes me as gross now. Maybe I’ve just grown out of it, which doesn’t bode too well for my enjoyment of the series.
Durin and Elrond do indeed still kick ass tho.
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@Wizz I’m a bit miffed about Gil-Galad being… well, disagreeable. Not quite a villain but certainly douchey if you get my drift.
Come on. It’s this guy:
Gil-galad was an Elven-king.
Of him the harpers sadly sing;
the last whose realm was fair and free
between the Mountains and the Sea.His sword was long, his lance was keen.
His shining helm afar was seen;
the countless stars of heaven’s field
were mirrored in his silver shield.But long ago he rode away,
and where he dwelleth none can say;
for into darkness fell his star
in Mordor where the shadows are.On the other hand complaints by hardcore fans are getting absolutely ridiculous at this point. One person actually complained Numenorians are too short - why isn’t Elendil a giant?
Good luck finding a bunch of 7 foot tall good actors who fit the roles.
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@Wizz said in The Rings of Power - Discussion:
I gotta admit, some of the shine came off for me in the episode before last when Galadriel confronted Halbrand and was basically like, “ugh pathetic, man you’re above these commoner rags.”
I know it’s probably an incredibly silly thing to complain about considering this is Tolkien but like, the whole romantic fantasy of how noble and divine the concept of monarchy is just strikes me as gross now. Maybe I’ve just grown out of it, which doesn’t bode too well for my enjoyment of the series.
Durin and Elrond do indeed still kick ass tho.
I feel the same way. I’ve loved Tolkien’s world and books since my earliest memories of being able to read at all, and I’m still greatly enjoying the show, but depictions of servile adoration for fictional monarchies hits different now.
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@Kestrel
I hate when people and publications act like there’s some sort of rivalry between this and GoT or like you have to choose one over the other or whatever because that is just endlessly dumb, but I do think in this one area you could actually make the case that GoT is the better series in that on the whole it doesn’t mimic Tolkien’s weird glazed-eye fawning over feudalism like so many other fantasy series and presents it at least fairly realisticly as deeply flawed and problematic instead.I was very much the same as a kid and just took it all at face value, lol. It almost makes me wonder if that’s at least some part of why so many modern people have this rosy fondness for actual real world monarchies, just having grown up with these glowing and romantic fantasies? If even remotely true…big oofs.
