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Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread
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@Meg said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Real talk, does a ban on Ares wipe the pages? That seems silly. Wouldn’t the pages still exist in the data? Because if there are pages that exist that prove PlayerX/Isaac was actually communicating for the whole of the scene and saying everything was OK, I am going to say it:
That casts this whole incident in a different light.
I think it’s important to note that this issue didn’t come up because @Cobalt is like reviewing everyone’s scenes for compliance. It was brought to her attention by one of the people in question, so someone wasn’t on board.
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@shit-piss-love said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
@Meg said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Real talk, does a ban on Ares wipe the pages? That seems silly. Wouldn’t the pages still exist in the data? Because if there are pages that exist that prove PlayerX/Isaac was actually communicating for the whole of the scene and saying everything was OK, I am going to say it:
That casts this whole incident in a different light.
I think it’s important to note that this issue didn’t come up because @Cobalt is like reviewing everyone’s scenes for compliance. It was brought to her attention by one of the people in question, so someone wasn’t on board.
Considering who the someone else was, I have no doubt this person reported the scene because they were done with Macha and wanted them off the game so they didn’t expose their harem-building. It is very much part of their MO.
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Yeah. Like, Macha definitely has her own toxic traits and issues, but it is sounding more like this incident could entirely be manufactured by PlayerX.
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@Meg said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Yeah. Like, Macha definitely has her own toxic traits and issues, but it is sounding more like this incident could entirely be manufactured by PlayerX.
Sort of the danger of being a piece of shit. You lose the benefit of the doubt.
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@Meg said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Real talk, does a ban on Ares wipe the pages? That seems silly. Wouldn’t the pages still exist in the data? Because if there are pages that exist that prove PlayerX/Isaac was actually communicating for the whole of the scene and saying everything was OK, I am going to say it:
That casts this whole incident in a different light.
I asked around a little, and it MAY be the case that pages only get wiped when a character is set as Gone (which Mackenzie hasn’t been yet). And the pages would only be wiped from that one character’s account, but not the other person’s they were paging with. Faraday would ofc know for sure, I’m not on the Ares discord.
More general points that are relevant that I know with more confidence I’ve seen discussed is that each game can set how long before page/PM history expires; could be set to days, could be set to years, just depends on what the game runner does. A game admin can’t just easily go and see someone’s PM history, though; the PMs have to be reported to them. (With the usual caveat of “they live in the database somewhere, someone with enough expertise could probably dig them up.” But the system isn’t designed to make them freely accessible.)
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@Roz I guess it could be as easy as @Cobalt resetting the password, jumping onto the bit and checking the page history but I wouldn’t blame her if she didn’t want to do that.
I also know that Ruiz prefers to keep their communication off-game and will frequently defer to Discord as a method of communicating.
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@bear_necessities Imagine the landmine of pages in there. If the scene was triggering, I imagine the other stuff could be even worse. I wouldn’t want to look up that history.
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@Testament said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
@kalakh said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Ghost: Here are some wild ass accusations I’m trying to disguise as Just Asking Questions, my receipts are “bitches be crazy” and “my ass”.
Ghost, the Tucker Carlson of the mush community.
Eh. Tucker Carlson has an audience and influence. Ghost is more some guy vaguely near Q-Anon shaman with his iphone out pretending that makes him a journalist.
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@shit-piss-love I swear I just read it for the articles!
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@bear_necessities said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
I also know that Ruiz prefers to keep their communication off-game and will frequently defer to Discord as a method of communicating.
Okay, that… is a huge red flag to me. Asking to communicate off game has never ended well in my experience.
I don’t trigger easily, but that is definitely something that as soon as it’s suggested it’s “Shields up! Red Alert!”
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@Adora I had not, but now I am cleaning coffee off my monitor. Thanks!
… a lot! xD
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@shit-piss-love said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Isn’t that the same here? With the majority assuming bad faith of anyone who tries to explain or defend themselves? I mean, there is a substantive difference in that, at least here, the admin won’t ban someone for having a differing opinion from them, but the same attitude pervades.
I can’t think of a single instance here where people piled onto someone without any evidence, let alone invented evidence of misdeeds wholesale like is going on over there on that thread.
I would counter that and say that there is a very strong dis-incentive for anyone who is accused of something to say anything here at all. If there is a narrative already established, regardless of any evidence presented in either direction, it doesn’t matter. In some cases it’s kind of like the (relatively recent) news media trick (that both sides use, this isn’t political) where someone says something and other folks report on the saying of the thing, and thus “the thing” becomes prevailing reality because it’s repeated without its basis being challenged.
All of this being said - absolutely zero reason for Cobalt or anyone else to go to another forum to defend themselves against straight up lies. Not worth the energy, most of the folks advancing conjecture have their minds fully made up, and are just using the question form for a slim layer of accountability to say “I didn’t say that, I asked if it was possible.”
And that just feeds in, like above, to the “We have a report that Person A said Person B eats poop” repeated report, without ever addressing the accuracy of the poop eating itself.
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@Roz said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Someone can experience traumatic things and still go on to do shitty things.
Seconding this. Way back in 2000, I got some sexual trauma (don’t worry, I’m not going to talk about it) related to MUSHing. It wasn’t until earlier this year I realized it had fucked me up so bad I’ve been repeating the cycle by continually putting myself in positions to have it happen to me again, and again, and again.
I guess it’s that whole “if you’re born in a burning house, then you think it’s normal for the world to be on fire” thing. I feel like the only value I have to people is as kindling, so I keep looking for fires surrounded by people who seem likely to throw me onto them, because that’s when things feel normal to me. Not right, but normal.
None of this is an excuse for my behavior or Macha’s, though. Just an explanation.
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@bailey Plus many can’t go over and comment - they are “terrorists”.
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@bailey said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
I would counter that and say that there is a very strong dis-incentive for anyone who is accused of something to say anything here at all.
I would argue this is true if the thing you’re accused of doing fits your pattern of behavior.
If someone accused me of creating games and getting frustrated and dropping them and I was like NO THAT’S NOT ME I DON’T DO THAT, that would be stupid. Everyone could point to all the times I did that, and no amount of BUT I’VE CHANGED!! can counter the last 4 years of evidence.
If someone accused me of some creepy weirdo shit like harem-building that (omg i hope!!!) doesn’t fit my rep, I’d absolutely come here and defend myself.
Which I think is what you mean by this:
@bailey said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
If there is a narrative already established, regardless of any evidence presented in either direction, it doesn’t matter.
So yes. If your rep is that you’re a fucking creeper and you get called out here for it, then your best bet is to wait for the 24-hour news cycle to reset.
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@bailey said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
I would counter that and say that there is a very strong dis-incentive for anyone who is accused of something to say anything here at all. If there is a narrative already established, regardless of any evidence presented in either direction, it doesn’t matter. In some cases it’s kind of like the (relatively recent) news media trick (that both sides use, this isn’t political) where someone says something and other folks report on the saying of the thing, and thus “the thing” becomes prevailing reality because it’s repeated without its basis being challenged.
All of this being said - absolutely zero reason for Cobalt or anyone else to go to another forum to defend themselves against straight up lies. Not worth the energy, most of the folks advancing conjecture have their minds fully made up, and are just using the question form for a slim layer of accountability to say “I didn’t say that, I asked if it was possible.”
And that just feeds in, like above, to the “We have a report that Person A said Person B eats poop” repeated report, without ever addressing the accuracy of the poop eating itself.
I find this an odd assertion considering you have your own thread here where you stated your side, were listened to, and some amount of people reading decided this exonerated you at least in part. That’s exactly how it should go. The systems works.
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@KarmaBum said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
@bailey said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
I would counter that and say that there is a very strong dis-incentive for anyone who is accused of something to say anything here at all.
I would argue this is true if the thing you’re accused of doing fits your pattern of behavior.
I’d say that this would also stand when people are just started establishing said pattern of behavior. Because as you point out, once that happens, it’s completely pointless. I’d contend it’s of minimal value even before that.
Which I think is what you mean by this:
@bailey said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
If there is a narrative already established, regardless of any evidence presented in either direction, it doesn’t matter.
So yes. If your rep is that you’re a fucking creeper and you get called out here for it, then your best bet is to wait for the 24-hour news cycle to reset.
No. I am talking about before any rep has been established. I mean narrative in a more limited sense, as in the narrative of a specific situation. It only takes a few situations to declare something a pattern, and if either (or both) of those situations aren’t accurate, but don’t get refuted, AND they also serve to prop each other up, well then there you have your pattern, which is wholly irrefutable.
It’s neither here nor there, but it’s how it works. It’s how Enrico Palazzo gets credit for saving the Queen, because enough repetition of something makes it true.
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There’s also the matter of trust.
If a trusted person brings an assertion, we’re more inclined to believe them than the un-trusted person bringing a counter claim, or refutation.
That’s just how people work, it’s not exclusive to us.
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@shit-piss-love said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
I find this an odd assertion considering you have your own thread here where you stated your side, were listened to, and some amount of people reading decided this exonerated you at least in part. That’s exactly how it should go. The systems works.
Heh. The thread where I was told to stop responding because it made it look like I was “fixated” despite other folks continuing to bring it up, and then making more and more assertions and “I FEEL like” conjecture (which are, ironically, pretty similar to what we’re talking about here with “I just have a “reasonable” question about my theory…”
Agree to disagree on that one.
I’m just saying, someone asked for an example, I gave an example. And I’ll take my own advice now.
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I know that it certainly refutes any claims made about you when you come in and make situations in unrelated threads a chance to once again make it about you for sure.
