@Warma-Sheen said in Warma-Sheen:
The only time there’s been an accusation of cheating that was even close to true was on City of Glass. Another player who I knew RL and was close with at the time had my password and logged on my character to a social scene.
This is embarrassing. Please take time to reflect on your actions. If that’s impossible, please take time to come up with better excuses.
@Jennkryst That explains a lot about my household, including the faking coughing and ‘boo, you whore’ earlier today.
@Pavel said in Tough Calls:
@Tez said in Tough Calls:
I have cautioned people on behavior that could, if not corrected, eventually lead to a ban, so I GUESS I issue warnings, but not in the manner I used to
Not that I want to accuse you of impropriety or anything, but do you find that you’re more willing to caution/counsel people with whom you’ve already established a rapport or relationship vs a relative unknown?
I ask only because I very much do feel that way; I’d be much more inclined to tell you, for instance, to knock it off vs someone I don’t know who’d just get a boot. I know it’s a bias that some would object to but I also tend to avoid staffing these days, precisely because I know my own biases enough to know I can’t be bothered.
That’s actually a really interesting point. You’re totally right. I would tell my friends to knock shit off in a way where it doesn’t register as a warning as such to my brain – which probably makes me more likely to do so.
I just don’t have the same sense of needing to be cautious or delicate with them, because I know that they will take what I say in the spirit in which it is intended, and change behavior. I can think of instances where I’ve definitely told friends offhand to knock shit off in a way where I’d stop and have to have a staff conversation to see if others feel it’s appropriate to warn a stranger.
But.
In my head, I don’t necessarily think of it as warning my friend.
Damn, you right.
@Yam said in Tough Calls:
I’d like to hear some experiences from staffers that have had to make the tough call to ban what they’d consider problematic players, or players that were simply not a good fit.
Hi.
I used to be a very evidence-based staffer. When I was on Firan’s player management staff, we would create logs, records, have observers that would follow people around and stalk them, and all of this shit was normalized. You had to create a legal case for banning someone.
That informed my approach for years. Then I saw on Arx that you don’t HAVE to do this, and it was like the heavens opened and I saw the light.
What factored into your decision?
I’m pretty unashamedly vibe-based now. If someone gives me bad vibes, then I don’t fucking have the time for this. My ass is tired. It’s 2025.
How did you approach it? Did you consult with other staffers?
I tend to staff in groups. When someone gives me bad vibes, I flag it immediately to the group. I’m usually one of the first people in the group to flag someone, so often I get told to wait – but I don’t think there has been a case on recent games where I flagged someone that we didn’t end up later banning, or else they distanced after a warning.
Once someone gives me bad vibes, I tend to watch them a bit more critically. However, it’s not a case where I’m building a case against them with documented evidence. I’m often the person who actually confronts the person and bans them, bc my anxiety is so medicated, or else I just feel more confident in the fact that I do have the power in that situation.
I mean, that’s real. I can’t lie. I have the power to decide where I want to spend my energy, and I don’t want to spend it on them. So I ask them to leave.
Did you receive any backlash? Did you set aside time to discuss the ban with them or did you simply notify and ban?
I don’t recall receiving much backlash from other players about any bans. I am somewhat sensitive to the fact that I might not receive public backlash on this forum, either, because I am a mod here. I plan to resign as a mod the next time I run the game, because it does feel a little squidgy to me.
I have received backlash for some policies I pushed for: particularly policies around avoiding oversharing on public channels. I’ve been called ableist, etc. But not for a ban.
I don’t tend to discuss bans with players being banned. It’s very much a ‘you have 15 minutes to grab anything you need, goodbye.’ I don’t feel it’s a good use of my time and energy to engage in prolonged discussion.
I do sometimes receive backlash in that time from the player being banned, where they get on public channels to protest rather than speaking with me privately. That’s their choice.
Did you issue warnings?
I have cautioned people on behavior that could, if not corrected, eventually lead to a ban, so I GUESS I issue warnings, but not in the manner I used to. We used to have this idea that someone had to have three strikes of warnings before they would be banned. Thank god I don’t do that anymore.
Did it result in a healthier atmosphere, a worse atmosphere, or something else?
I’m reluctant to answer this question. I think we are somewhat blind to the results of our actions. I’d be more interested to hear how players would answer this.
It resulted in less stress for me, though.
@helvetica And yet, ironically, I would only actually use it with those I trust not to take me seriously.
Damn, maybe I should avoid it.
It’s okay if you want to riot. Maybe I should stop telling people to get fucked.
@Yam said in Empire Discussion Thread:
@Tez I need you to split this convo off into a topic called Is Banning Bad, Actually?
Get fucked.
@Faraday said in Empire Discussion Thread:
@Tez said in Empire Discussion Thread:
I think it’s a mistake to treat this as a generic case rather than a specific one.
Why? The convo has long since spun off from WS/Ada into a more generic discussion about whether it’s best to tow a hard line on banning people for “being rude” (which is an incredibly vague line that I’d be willing to bet WE HAVE ALL CROSSED, intentionally or not, at one point or another).
I don’t think it’s true that people are actually all treating it as such. I think – and I say this with GENTLE SARCASM ONLY because TONE IS HARD IN TEXT – that we might all be coming into this from different perspectives based on our own experiences with the people involved and the situation at large. I don’t think it’s really a pure abstract thought exercise here. This is coming from a very specific example.
@Meg said in Empire Discussion Thread:
@Yam i’m not on either side. i literally care nothing for either of these people. in my opinion, some of the people pushing back are not pushing back on this specific instance, just on the idea that its actually a good thing to go nuclear as soon as someone is rude.
I think it’s a mistake to treat this as a generic case rather than a specific one.
@bear_necessities said in Empire Discussion Thread:
If Pyre banned you right now for doing absolutely nothing except responding to a post, there would undoubtedly be backlash and it probably wouldn’t hold (although half of us would say you deserved it, then another half would say Pyre’s power-tripping, and there’d be a ton of back and forth about the perception of your tone and what you SHOULD have said vs what you DID say along with a disseration-level deep dive on what you implied with your perceived tone like we are literary scholars … sound familiar?)
It’s about time for a spin off. Let’s go.
Moved a few posts about how to get an account here. lol i love my bubble.
@Artemis Just DM an email to me and I will make an account w an invite link that goes to that email. It could be your email. Your cousins email. A temp email. I don’t care. You do need to be able to access it for the invite link and password resets.
We had a run of bad actors so account creation is limited atm.
@Artemis If they want an account, I just need an email. If they don’t, they are wise beyond measure.
@somasatori You know, that’s fair. The tone of the question wasn’t great though, and that’s what I think I’m responding to.
I find the setting and conflict of empire a bit nebulous and hard to grasp myself but I don’t need to be shitty about a new game and a widely played older game to say so. My friends seem to be grabbing it fine!
