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MU Peeves Thread
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@bear_necessities yikes. I know the world is dark and gritty, but yikes. THAT WOULD INDEED be the kind of game culture where I would just leave.
let it be a challenge to you
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@sao said in MU Peeves Thread:
@bear_necessities yikes. I know the world is dark and gritty, but yikes. THAT WOULD INDEED be the kind of game culture where I would just leave.
It sadly took me awhile to find out that wasn’t normal game culture especially when I was playing Firan at the same time and having my child commoner repeatedly told by her UNCLE that he couldn’t wait until she became ‘of age’ so he could get his noble priviledge on …
But that was years ago at least. Now weird sexual culture is less rapey and more figuring out how to navigate who is safe to TS with and who isn’t.
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While we still have a long way to go, and there is still a lot problematic, I do notice that predatory female-presenting players are being called out more often, and more and more people are kind of stiff arming the dude who tries to harem build by telling everyone how they’re his favorite and it’s the other women’s fault that he doesn’t RP with her as much like he really wants to. I think this is because we’re all getting old, but also I notice in my own young adult kids that honestly they’re just a lot better about consent and not tolerating SOME of the crap I know women of my generation have been steeped in to expect. It’s hard to shake free of. But I do so more effort being made of that than I did in the 90s.
Also, I think one of the things that people overlook a lot is that women have ALWAYS been /essential/ in subjugating other women and enforcing purity culture. I grew up in a very culty religious sect and even there it is plain as day to me now. It’s a little like how people who feel like they have to fight the hardest for recognition/legitimacy/a place at the table tend to always tear each other up first. Or something like that. You saw it all the time when I first got into mushing. The female presenting bogeymen of the mush world tend to utilize that too. But. I do think we have less tolerance for abuse now than we once did. More willingness to give people the boot. I think perhaps we still aren’t acting quickly enough against female-presenting people, but that doesn’t mean that we should slow down how we react to others.
I think I have a much higher tolerance for “darker” themes than the majority of my friends do. But utter incompetence at discernment always irritates me. Whether that is someone who will not fucking shut up with the ooc diarrhea of the text when everyone else is not doing that and listening to the ST’s request to keep that to channels, to cutesy Spank Me Daddy/Mommy tabletalk at a public formal event. It’s not entirely fair because some people just don’t have the skills to read the room, but that’s also why most games have policies on types of play permitted in public or STs give freaking instructions at the beginning of the scene!
I could not care less if someone only likes to rp being led around on a leash with a ball gag in their mouth or whatever. I think that’s great and if they find someone who loves to RP leading someone gagged and collared around on a leash then that makes my heart happy. I’m not being sarcastic. If they’re on a game and in a place that is labeled a NSFW zone and is named “Play Park for People Who Don’t Want To Have to Run To Go Get Their Ball”, I mean if I go in there and then whine about seeing some tits and ass and people on or off leashes then I’m a major asshole. If I harass them, then I should be kicked to the curb by staff.
But by the same token, if I’m on a game that allows certain triggery elements in backstory but requires proactive consent from EVERYONE in the scene before any of that is mentioned or says all public places need to be free of references to abuse, ect and I violate that then I should be kicked to the curb too.
Regardless of my thoughts about sex being healthy and good and not shameful, if I play on a place that asks that no sexual RP happens in a public space, then I should utilize discretion and just…keep it to private. (and apologize for any mavs).
Having rules isn’t necessarily shaming, and if you’re choosing to play on a place that has 'em, I mean don’t read or pay attention to shit if that’s your bag, but also don’t whine and stomp if you get the boot or a talking to. Or fuss. Just take it as an oops, and then make your own decision to either stay and follow the policy or go play on a game where people aren’t paying attention as much or where they welcome it.
It should be that easy. I don’t know why it isn’t for a few, but I’m glad that more and more games are not giving them a bazillion chances.
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Personally, I will almost always find public TS/LOOK AT ME I NAUGHTY stuff unintentionally hilarious. Yes, I have a very juvenile sense of humor. I LOVE fart pranks too and will never get tired of watching them on Youtube. I have had horribad TS writing competitions with friends. (usually I win, too 'cause I’m gifted like that). If you are the lucky recipient/writer of an outrageous sex pose and you are going to pop if you don’t share it with someone else, hmu, i will never say no no matter what it is.
But. Have some respect for the rules and culture of the game. If you’re on a game that highlights sexuality, don’t be a Karen and complain about footsie going on at the footsie bar. If you’re on a game that requires that stuff be private, don’t hump the arm of the king’s throne in the middle of court. If it’s in a gray area, I tend to ask someone if they mind stopping doing something that’s causing me distress, but if I read more that I’m in the minority then I’ll try to extricate. If I’m not able to be out and about in public without running into a lot of annoyances, I reevaluate whether the game is for me, just because if they have rules that I like/need that aren’t enforced then I need to be realistic about that.
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Game expectations should be transparent and known.
Players shouldn’t be dicks.
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@tsar said in MU Peeves Thread:
Nah, if you start tossing your kinks in my face in a public scene I’m going to object. There are places for that, it’s not most MUs.
So we agree. I don’t understand the ‘nah’ part unless you missed the whole part where I said to object?
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@tsar said in MU Peeves Thread:
Just leave. If you remove the audience, you remove what they’re after.
This. Why should I have to remove myself from RP when someone’s decided to make other people their captive audience?
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@mietze said in MU Peeves Thread:
While we still have a long way to go, <snip>
YES. Yes yes yes to all of this. I think you really made good points and that’s exactly what I’m saying. Rather than trying to have some sort of weird publicly shamey but behind the scenes everything is different sort of culture, just talk that shit out.
Set game wide expectations of behavior and empower players to speak up against things that make them uncomfortable. We tend to relegate too much to talking behind someone’s back or let it eat us up and just ‘deal with it’ because maybe it seems like no one else is bothered. I’ve been guilty of it too.
Honestly though, if I’m in a scene with A and B, and then C and D come in and start behaving in a way that makes me uncomfortable (which honestly doesn’t have to always be sexual in nature) but I don’t feel comfortable myself saying ‘hey weirdos, cut that out’, I would hope that I can page A and B and be like ‘hey, this isn’t working for me, can we move the scene?’ If they can’t, why am I going to invest my time working on building a story with them?
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@tsar Did you miss this? — Additionally, loud and clear boundary setting should be the gold standard. I’d rather hear a complaint of ‘these people were doing this and several of us stated that we didn’t feel comfortable with the scene and they continued to ignore our boundaries’ rather than ‘I wish people wouldn’t do this because ew’. Is there a difference? Absolutely. One scenario expects others to recognize that people are making you uncomfortable. The other gives them the option to either respect your feelings without any guessing games. It shows other players healthy boundary setting and communication. —
Because I think y’all might have missed that whole part.
Understandable, have a nice day.
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@Luna said in MU Peeves Thread:
Because I think y’all might have missed that whole part.
There’s a lot to miss.
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@bear_necessities said in MU Peeves Thread:
But I mean TBF I don’t think the definition of weird sex culture is like, boning in public or whatever.
Ok, but you keep addressing it like it’s a sex in public thing. What is ‘weird sex culture’? And frankly, if it’s the culture of the game and you’re not vibing that’s kind of on you and different from people who interrupt scenes with something that’s not the accepted norm.
It’s more like … on several non-consent WoD games
I’m gonna be that bitch. I see zero reason for a game to be non-consent. Absolutely none.
I used to play, where I was told that as a mortal I shouldn’t go out in public alone because I’d get SA’d and/or murdered by a vampire/werewolf/whatever because WoD is so DARK AND GRITTY and it’s just acceptable culturally to do that sort of thing. That’s a pretty extreme example but goes with what I’m saying here.
Murder, uh yeah. Murder is pretty on point. I think SA as a built in ‘woooo suuuuper daaaark’ threat is lazy and cliche.
Understandable, have a nice day.
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@helvetica said in MU Peeves Thread:
@Luna said in MU Peeves Thread:
Because I think y’all might have missed that whole part.
There’s a lot to miss.
I’m less than ideally medicated and am doing my level best.
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@Luna said in MU Peeves Thread:
As pro kink as I am, do I love people being roped into other peoples public displays of whatever? No. But I’m honestly not going to be outspoken about it like I once was. Just leave. If you remove the audience, you remove what they’re after. Only you can set your boundaries and you’re in charge of them. (Unless it’s your work place RL then everyone can fuck right off because no one wants to be there in the first place, don’t make shit weird).
I’m going to return to this passage, because I don’t believe it’s as clear as you may think it is. When you suggest that people should “just leave”, it shifts responsibility.
It’s now the responsibility of the person uncomfortable to leave. It’s now their responsibility to remove the audience.
That said, I think we generally agree on a large number of other points and it’s possible stuff is just getting lost in semantics. But that’s how I took what you wrote there.
Moving along:
Despite previous posts, lol, I’m not a hardcore confrontational person (unless you’re that dude who thoughtposed and RPed cabbages at me). If I run into someone and they’re generally kind of weird, I’ll make an effort to avoid them. I won’t hop into their scenes, because I think it’s fair to allow them the RP they want without my interruptions.
But in general like, just don’t wander into people’s scenes and be disruptive. It might not be work, but it’s my hobby time and I’d rather not have to swim against the current here too.
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@tsar said in MU Peeves Thread:
Despite previous posts, lol, I’m not a hardcore confrontational person
did someone say CONFRONTATIONAL
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@Roz said in MU Peeves Thread:
@tsar said in MU Peeves Thread:
Despite previous posts, lol, I’m not a hardcore confrontational person
did someone say CONFRONTATIONAL
lol I almost tagged you to say “I need @Roz here to confirm my deep fear of confrontation”
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@Luna said in MU Peeves Thread:
What is ‘weird sex culture’?
I tried out a new game. The lore the game is based on is sexist af, it is known, and the game runners were remaining more or less dedicated to the original theme with a few exceptions that made me feel slightly better about dipping my toe in. But then the highest-ranking female character, an NPC, seemed trotted out for sex more than anything else. And male PCs had lists of sexual conquests in their IC connections. And a few other red flags popped up that now escape me. Anyway, I bounced! Didn’t name and shame because it was not an abusive situation. It was just a weird sex culture that I didn’t sign up for.
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@tsar said in MU Peeves Thread:
@Luna said in MU Peeves Thread:
As pro kink as I am, do I love people being roped into other peoples public displays of whatever? No. But I’m honestly not going to be outspoken about it like I once was. Just leave. If you remove the audience, you remove what they’re after. Only you can set your boundaries and you’re in charge of them. (Unless it’s your work place RL then everyone can fuck right off because no one wants to be there in the first place, don’t make shit weird).
I’m going to return to this passage, because I don’t believe it’s as clear as you may think it is. When you suggest that people should “just leave”, it shifts responsibility.
It’s now the responsibility of the person uncomfortable to leave. It’s now their responsibility to remove the audience.
I personally am non confrontational and would rather just leave, no skin off my nose. It’s the first thought that comes to mind. A lot of people, myself in the past included, would remain, be miserable, but also not speak up, and hate the whole thing.
You keep fixating on that line and ignoring my whole ‘gold standard’ statement, which I believe in, despite the fact that I know from personal experience and statements literally on this board that some of us suffer from anxiety and aren’t going to go all Ace Attorney and object to fuck all.
That said, I think we generally agree on a large number of other points and it’s possible stuff is just getting lost in semantics. But that’s how I took what you wrote there.
Moving along:
Despite previous posts, lol, I’m not a hardcore confrontational person (unless you’re that dude who thoughtposed and RPed cabbages at me). If I run into someone and they’re generally kind of weird, I’ll make an effort to avoid them. I won’t hop into their scenes, because I think it’s fair to allow them the RP they want without my interruptions.
Literally same, hence first inclination is leave, but that statement seems to have caused some sort of issue.
But in general like, just don’t wander into people’s scenes and be disruptive. It might not be work, but it’s my hobby time and I’d rather not have to swim against the current here too.
Yeah, that would be great, but clearly either they don’t realize it’s an issue, so you have to say something, or they don’t care, leaving the only solution for immediate relief is to leave.
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I’m really confrontational.
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@helvetica said in MU Peeves Thread:
But then the highest-ranking female character, an NPC, seemed trotted out for sex more than anything else. And male PCs had lists of sexual conquests in their IC connections.
Yeah I can see how that would be off putting for sure. But at least they were up front about it!
