Bannings

[hellfrog]

@Narson said in Bannings:

@Roz Typo. It is The Froge. It’s the new cool @hellfrog nightclub where everyone wears a frog mask and commits insane acts of bullying terrorism in DMs. The downstairs moshpit.

I do literally all my bullying out in the open. I hate DMs

[Testament]

@IoleRae said in Bannings:

@Narson

I lost a twenty year friendship over this bullshit, and I’m probably never going to get over it.

For whatever it is worth, you were one of the very few people who reached to me when I was at my lowest point when all this shit kicked off. When I went emotionally off the deep end.

You helped me in way that perhaps only one or two others did or even bothered to do when I was struggling far more than I’d like to admit.

I’m sorry you lost someone close to you.

[IoleRae]

@Testament

I think that’s one of the kindest things anybody has said to me in a long time. Thank you for telling me, and I’m so glad I was able to help. I’m even MORE glad that things are going better for you, and super excited for your October 8th. Almost as excited as I am about SPACE PICTURES.

[eye8urcake]

So, even though (or maybe because?) I wasn’t really part of the mass forced exodus from MSB, I’m going to make a couple of observations about why this topic is probably more healthy than not.

1. One of the major problems I keep hearing in the posts of the people grieving the loss of their community and long-time friends is that the bans and breaking of MSB leaves them needing a proactive way and place to vent, which this has become. As opposed to a serious tail-chasing ‘fuck MSB in its neck’, what I’m seeing (YMMV) is more like ‘fuck MSB for banning me for engaging in conversations in the very same way I/we/they had for literally years’. This seems to be leading to conversations even within the thread that hash out how setting out different behavioral and engagement expectations will form a healthier community, and I think that’s a good evolution.

2. As a person who has… I want to say two? maybe three?.. solid, 30+ year old grudges, against family members to boot, that I just can’t seem to let go of and that have absolutely shaped me and my perceptions and interactions as an adult, in hindsight I realize if I’d been able to pop the zit (so to speak) of those relationships with other people of different levels of empathy and perspective, I’d be a better, healthier person with far less conflict under my belt. I think this thread is those people popping their collective zits, which may be carrying a gross metaphor too far but which I think, in the end, will actually minimize the amount of resentment people who feel that they have been persecuted, bullied and defamed out of their community. That’s a win for this forum, and their/our future interactions, period.

So, I mean, TL;DR - while wallowing too deeply in anger, insult, and bad feels for too long isn’t going to be cathartic but detrimental, a benefit having other people who went through the same thing coming to build the new community acknowledging what actions led to the necessity of the splinter and what about the construction of the original community led to that is a net gain for everybody.

[Arkandel]

I don’t want to take sides. And I have received a number of messages on Discord asking me to. It’s not my place to do so any more.

But I will say this. It’s made me a bit sad. For a very long time I enjoyed the idea of a single forum open to everyone in the hobby where we could all either speak our minds or - worst case scenario - be able to coexist with those we didn’t like.

Now the community seems fractured. Hopefully it is a problem that will fix itself.

So… I am still sad about this state of affairs. When I was part of the hobby I worked hard to ensure it doesn’t come to this. I suppose it’s what it is.

[Jennkryst]

@Arkandel I, for one, would like someone to explain how you were not banned for speaking twice after the ‘DO NOT SPEAK’ threat, yet @Narson was banned for speaking just once… specifically asking why you were immune to the VERY CLEAR AND TOTALLY JUSTIFIED AND FAIR DECISION THAT ANYONE WHO SPOKE WAS TO BE BANNED.

If that’s taking sides… I dunno. I was banned for supposedly requesting it, without the chance to clarify what my post meant. It is what it is.

[Arkandel]

@Jennkryst I suspect you know the answer to that question.

But if you are asking me, you’re asking the wrong person.

For the record, I barely read the thread (or most un-fun threads ) to even know what was going on until well after the fact, and was confused at first about why it’d be an issue to post on it at all.

[Jennkryst]

@Arkandel The ‘someone explain’ wasn’t meant to be directed at you to explain, and yeah, we all know why.

I just think it would be funny if you, specifically, pointed out the hypocrisy of it. Or maybe not, I dunno, it’s hot at work and I’m annoyed at how easy it is that I’m getting worked up over all this shit again.

Also, the catharsis of getting one of them to state it plainly would be amazing.

[IoleRae]

@Jennkryst

That’s really not a fair request to make of him, he’s stated he doesn’t want to pick a side.

[Third Eye]

@Arkandel said in Bannings:

Now the community seems fractured. Hopefully it is a problem that will fix itself.

I do think it’ll sort itself out in time. We’ve all been through lots of cycles on these many MU boards and for better or worse this doesn’t feel too different to me than the way the other ones came to be over the years. Not that it doesn’t bum me out, it’s a very niche hobby and having users scattered sucks just in terms of ease of use if nothing else, and the I feel for folks who’ve had actual strained or damaged personal relationships. It has been cool to see old names pop up here, though, you among them.

I’m not personally looking for any rhyme or reason to the bannings that went down in that thread, I doubt I’d find any answers I got non-aggravating anyway even if the MSB mods want to give them someday, so. So it goes.

[tsar]

shine lamp on @Arkandel like old school detective show

And why weren’t YOU banned, hmmmmmm?

[eye8urcake]

@tsar said in Bannings:

shine lamp on @Arkandel like old school detective show

And why weren’t YOU banned, hmmmmmm?

[Jennkryst]

@IoleRae said in Bannings:

@Jennkryst

That’s really not a fair request to make of him, he’s stated he doesn’t want to pick a side.

This is fair, and I should clarify: I am not asking @Arkandel to actually do it.

But I am definitely implying that I would do a little chaos goblin laugh and/or dance if he chose to do it on his own.

[helvetica]

I was going to say something along the lines of… it might be worth something for @Arkandel to use whatever leverage they seem to have (they obviously want you around!) to ask those questions but like… that’d be fruitless.

My own ban was lifted because my comment calling Gany unhinged was deemed reasonable under the circumstances. Which in itself seems like a pretty glaring admission. There’s not much logic to follow there anymore besides the trail of people being highly emotional and reactive, and with good reason given how everything played out irl.

The rationalizations to keep the bans in place came after the fact and from someone else entirely. With a pretty clear agenda.

I think it already has sorted itself out? That’s just not our home, anymore. And just so I don’t end this response on such a sad note: I really like our new home, and I really like our new stepmoms.

[Arkandel]

@IoleRae said in Bannings:

That’s really not a fair request to make of him, he’s stated he doesn’t want to pick a side.

Just to explain that part though - which I think is fair.

I went to Ganymede, who’s been a friend of mine for many years, and someone whom I had (and still have) great respect for, to ask for a favor. I needed someone to take over MSB for me since I no longer played played on MU*. Gany accepted, which was great since otherwise I’d be screwed - I didn’t have a Plan B.

Now, what kind of absolute fucking asshole would I be if, a couple of months later and during the first time Gany got into hot waters, I got myself involved? Right after I ‘quit’ at that?

It’s not about MSB or MMU… BRMUD… BR… whatever the hell this forum’s acronym is. I don’t care.

But if I have a few friends left in the hobby it’s probably because I don’t go around stabbing them in the back.

[Tez]

@Jennkryst

I think it’s pretty obvious that no amount whacking that hornet’s nest with a stick will lead to any kind of satisfaction. There is no catharsis to be had. There are only a lot of hornets.

[tsar]

@Arkandel said in Bannings:

Now, what kind of absolute fucking asshole would I be if, a couple of months later and during the first time Gany got into hot waters, I got myself involved? Right after I ‘quit’ at that?

But more seriously, detective hats aside.

No one needs to go there and keep up the fight, there’s really no fight left there. And I definitely don’t think @Arkandel should.

[Testament]

Not every battle is a hill worth dying on. Sometimes, a stalemate is as good as you’re going to get.

And frankly, I think that what was borne out of necessity has become better than what it came from.

That’s a good thing, I think.

[KarmaBum]

I forgot this thread was here. I stand by my “let Derp’s forum lie” mentality, but also…

Derp has been completely honest about why certain bans were lifted and others weren’t: He doesn’t like us.

Which is completely fair. I don’t like him, either.
When he was made admin, I had every intention of just bouncing. But I realize now that I fucking care about this community, and he doesn’t, so I’m glad I came back.

I don’t expect to ever be unbanned there. Derp can’t handle people speaking truth to him, especially women.

The community that was WORA - that Arkandel handed over to Ganymede - isn’t fractured. It’s right fucking here.

WORA has never been an immutable line in the sand. It’s always a party that’s popped up at someone’s house 'cause their parents were out of town.

When Nymeria threatened copyright infringement and we had to flee off Proboards (or whatever that was), the community moved to a new location. This is the same thing: Ganymede torched our old neighborhood and gave the keys to Derp, so we just moved on.

[Narson]

Just going to say, as the one who got banned for asking why @Arkandel didn’t get banned when the beam of light that is @Snackness did, I absolutely don’t think any of that is on Arkandel and people shouldn’t even jokingly put him in the middle. As Ark says, we all know why, and as Karma says, we know why some bans weren’t lifted.

In the choice between my friendship with @Roz and @Tez (and the occasional arguments we have) or being able to post on a place that no longer has anyone I really care about on it, I know where I am and while it hurts to be excluded and lied about, I’m quite content and people don’t need to fret.

I mean, I’ve put hard work into getting Tez to understand Narsonese, so when I go ‘Not Alfred…damn it. Isaacs. Moon fellow. Jason!’ they know who I mean.